Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: So many people have said to me, oh, my gosh, that's what I am. And so I basically believe that everything is sacred, everything has legitimacy, that everything is co creating with us and is conscious, and we need to interact or engage with everything in the world in a respectful way that honors whatever it is, their legitimacy, or their right to be or their right to exist, but that everything is sacred essence. That's basically. That's how I describe it.
[00:01:22] Speaker B: Welcome to supernormalize, the podcast, where we challenge the conventional break boundaries, and normalize the seemingly supernatural. Join me, CJ, as we explore less uncharted realms of existence and unravel the mysteries of life. Experience. My treasured listeners, if you have a life story or healing modality or unique knowledge that you'd love to share, reach out to me at supernormalized. That's supernormalized with a z at proton me. Let's together embrace acceptance of the supernatural and unusual as what it really is. Completely normal. Today on super normalized, you'll meet with Kirsten Rodberg, a third culture kid who has lived in various parts of the world, reflects on how her diverse upbringing has profoundly influenced her outlook on life. And today we also talk about her experience of walking the Camino path, compassionate possession, and how that affected her in her life in positive ways to help others.
It was a great conversation I've had with Kirsten, and I'm sure you'll enjoy. So on with the show.
Welcome to supernormalize, Kirsten Rodberg. Kirsten, you've had quite an unusual life story. You grew up overseas, probably because your parents are moving you around a lot, and because of that, you actually had a lot of influence from the cultures you were in, the people you were around. And that caused you to actually have sort of like, more of an open view of the world. Can you tell us about all of that first? And welcome to Joe.
[00:02:52] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Thank you. It's so fun to be here. I'm super excited to have this conversation. My father worked for a company based out of Chicago, Illinois, that did hydroelectric dams and irrigation systems for developing countries. So because of that, we would move to other countries for extended periods of time. And the longest was when. When I lived in Lahore, Pakistan, for four years. But besides that, also traveling over the world was very normalized for us as well, because we had to get to these places. So I got to visit places like Thailand, Bangladesh, the Maldives, Kashmir, Sri Lanka, lots of places in South America. And as a kid getting to go to a school, I'll use Lahore as an example. With kids from all over the world, every religion, every culture, every kind of kid you can imagine was one of the biggest gifts of my entire life, because all we wanted to do was have fun and play and have a good time. And I didn't really understand what a gift it was until I went to seminary. Later on, I got my master's of divinity, and we were in a class, and it was a class to talk about colonialism, slavery. And one of my cohort. One of the people in my cohort started sobbing, and she said, you know, when I was little, I invited this little girl from school over. She was african American. And when she left, my dad beat me and said, you were never to have anyone like that in this house again. And she. I just really, at that moment, witnessed what my life could have been like if I hadn't. You know, not that my parents beat me, but if I hadn't been introduced at such a young age to multiplicity, to how different people are in the world, you know, whether it's religion or culture or what have you. I just. That was when I realized that my childhood was a massive, massive gift.
[00:04:54] Speaker B: Yeah, that's. That's cool. It would have been very interesting and mind expanding as a child, and it.
I think it shapes you in different sorts of ways. You actually start to see the way that people are in the world and realize that not everything's exactly the same, and not everything is exactly as it is with growing up with your own parents and seeing that it broadens your horizons.
[00:05:18] Speaker A: Oh, for sure. And I think it gives you a greater opportunity as a kid to more. To more fully appreciate the beauty or the different kinds of beauty in the world, whether it's architecture or art or the way a city is designed or food, because I think food is art. You know, when you're exposed to all this at such a young age, it kind of opens your horizons for what is potentially beautiful in the world or what can be beautiful.
[00:05:50] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, for sure. For sure. So how did that shape you as a child? I mean, what.
What did it do to you? I mean, did it drive you in certain directions when you said you got a master's in theology? So did it actually expand your understanding of spirit and connection to spirit? I mean, that's what it sounds like it was doing.
[00:06:08] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, I told everyone that when they brought me back to the states, the culture shock was so horrific that I do fourth grade again. I mean, I just could not adjust. I was so confused at going from such a multicultural world to the middle of Illinois, where everyone was white, which, there's nothing wrong with that. But as a kid who was used to having lots of freedom in all sorts of ways, all of a sudden, it mattered what I wore to school in Illinois. But I brought in my lunch, all of these things, and I couldn't adjust, and I didn't adjust. And so because I was struggling, they had me do fourth grade again.
And then I learned that I had a love for reading. So I spent the next few years hiding in the library by myself, reading books, which was amazing, and I loved it. And I've always been someone who absolutely is intrigued with how humans create meaning. And so my bookshelves are filled with fairy tales, myths, fable, folk tale from all over the world, because I'm endlessly interested in how humans figure their world out. And so going to seminary and getting my masters of divinity just seemed like a natural outgrowth for me to study on a greater level, on a greater platform. You know, my. My school is very liberal, so I took intro to Islam. I took Buddhism. I took a lot of different classes. I got to study in a more rigorous way how humans create meaning. So, yeah, that's how I ended up. Plus, I love learning. I mean, if I could, I would study the rest of my life if it wasn't so expensive. So, yeah, I mean, I'm. I'm a lifelong, curious learner. I want to be in school, if I could, the rest of my life.
[00:07:55] Speaker B: I can relate to that. I think life is about learning and creativity, and I do remember myself being in high school, and I think it was the sanctuary of all the sensitive kids is to go and hide in the library and read all the books or play chess.
I was there, too.
Okay, so you actually started writing as well and created a.
Was it a book, or was it the cartoon?
[00:08:24] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I have an animated series on YouTube called murder of two. I'm a screenwriter as well, and each episode is two to three minutes long, and it's about a two crows that sit on a line and observe humanity and how silly we are. And then I'm currently rewriting the Peter Rabbit stories. My third book just came out at the end of April. It's carried by George RR Martin's bookstore in Santa Fe, New Mexico, among other places. And I'm writing, rewriting those stories to more forcefully engage with, I guess you could call environmental ills, societal ills, human trafficking, sweatshops, what we're doing to the environment. I'm just making it more. It's more aggressive because I think the days of being nice about all this stuff, they're over for me, at least.
So. Yeah.
[00:09:10] Speaker B: Trying to wake those kids up.
[00:09:12] Speaker A: That's right.
[00:09:15] Speaker B: No childhood for you.
[00:09:17] Speaker A: That's right.
[00:09:21] Speaker B: Okay, so tell us about your murder of crows animated series. What subjects do you tackle there?
[00:09:30] Speaker A: Well, my first episode was in response to George Floyd and his murder in the US.
I don't know very many of your listeners. It was a us event where african american man was killed, murdered by police. And the video is horrific. I can't watch it because I know if I do, it's going to break my heart. But I was really struggling at that time to. And keep in mind that murder of two is in essence, I mean, it does make a lot of comments on things going on in the world, but it is a comedy show. At the end of the day, it's a comedy show, which, I know it's interesting to kind of combine those two things, but somehow I managed to do it.
But, yeah, it's my way of just talking about how silly. And it's also, I realize later, unconsciously, it's my comment on how God is probably looking down on us and wondering, what on earth are those humans doing? Because the crows sit on the line and they look down at these escapades that are happening in each episode, and they think, oh, my gosh, isn't it? It's so amazing we're crows because these humans are just crazy pants. Later on, I realized that it was my, my unconscious trying to kind of reconcile probably what God thinks of us or spirit or that energy, because I'm a panentheist, what that energy thinks of us as. It just probably shakes its head and watches as we all go about our days.
[00:11:01] Speaker B: So tell us about your experience of panentheism and what it means to you.
[00:11:06] Speaker A: Yeah. So I came to seminary with no religion. I was the only one, I think, out of my class of 35 or 38, that that had no religion. And I felt like a duck out of water. I mean, everyone else knew what they were doing, where they belonged, but I didn't. And then after the course of multiple months went through, and we're all going to school together, a couple of my cohort members who were very nice. Everyone was very nice. They said, you know what? I think we're going to self identify as panentheist now. And I thought, what's that? I don't even know what that is. And I realized after they described it, and I did some research that I've been a panentheist all along. I just didn't have the name for it. And it's been really interesting describing this word and telling people about it, because so many people have said to me, oh, my gosh, that's what I am. And so I basically believe that everything is sacred, everything has legitimacy, that everything is co creating with us and is conscious, and, you know, we need to interact or engage with everything in the world in a respectful way that honors whatever it is, their legitimacy or their right to be or their right to exist, but that everything is sacred in essence. That's basically. That's how I describe it.
[00:12:32] Speaker B: Yeah, I get that sort of point of view myself. And I believe that everything is God all of the time.
God, goddess, all of one, all the time, all experience, everything that's happening, all actions, all, everything that people do all of the time is God acting. And we're a part of it, whether we like it or not. That's just what happens.
[00:12:55] Speaker A: Absolutely. I love that. Yes. Two thumbs up.
[00:12:59] Speaker B: And so what do you think is the purpose of all this, then?
[00:13:03] Speaker A: You mean this creation? Yeah, like everything that's happening? Oh, gosh, you know, I wish I had the answer to that because I don't.
You know, lots of people come up with answers, and they're trying to figure out what all this is. Some grand experiment, some failed experiment, some, I don't know, weird bubble universe that is just an offshoot of the multiverse. I mean, that's what makes it exciting for me to. Because I love science, too. I've been reading science magazines since I was a kid.
That's what makes it exciting to wake up every day, because you never know what, on what frontier of science they're going to discover something new or prove something true, whether it's quantum mechanics or astronomy or dark matter, what have you, that makes it exciting to get up in the morning, because we don't know what all this is. I'm gesturing all over the place. It's kind of an adventure.
That's why humans have so many different religions and are trying to figure out what all this is and create all this meaning. I refuse to comment on that question.
[00:14:13] Speaker B: Okay, no comment. No comment. Okay.
So you actually ended up walking the Carmino di Santiago. It's like a faith walk. Was that actually driven by anything at the time? And what impact did that have upon your life?
[00:14:32] Speaker A: Well, it's. It's actually, that's. Those are both great questions because they dovetail. So I wasn't religious at the time, at all. And in 2010, I went down to Florida to be with a dear friend who was having, at the time, it was called. It was an experimental brain surgery for Parkinson's. And so I spent two and a half to three months with her as she got this Parkinson's surgery.
Unfortunately, it didn't work and she died the next year. She had a really aggressive form of Parkinson's, and I missed her. She was my best friend in the entire world. It was devastating to lose her. And so a few years after that, I was at a feast day outside of Portland, Oregon, at this amazing monastery. And the woman sitting next to me was exactly the carbon copy of my dear friend who had passed away from the hair to the jewelry. And I just, I thought, this is so eerie. And afterwards, you know, I went outside, we were talking after everyone's eating and what have you, and she was a presbyterian minister, and she said, oh, I'm gonna, you know, walk the Camino next spring. And I said, what? I, what is that? I don't even know what that is. And my partner, who is Catholic, who is Catholic, still said, oh, it's this walk, you know, it's this pilgrimage route in Europe. There's like twelve different ways of St. James. And I thought, oh, that's interesting. Cool, like, good for you. And a few months later, he gave me a few travel guides just to show me and demonstrate what it was. And I thought, cool, you know, I'm not religious. I'm not Catholic. I'm not. I have a job. I'm, thanks. Not interested, but not really interested. And then a few months go by and a good friend called me and she said, I just saw this movie that I loved and I think you're going to love it, so I'm going to mail it to you. And it was a dvd, okay, so I'm dating myself right now that it was a dvd. And I opened the package and it was the way by Emilio Estevez Martin Sheen about Martin Sheen walking the Camino. And I thought, oh, oh, I can, I guess I can see what the Camino is about through this movie. And it was a little maudlin, but also really sweet, and I appreciate it. And I thought, oh, that's interesting. Another interesting little coincidence, someone sent me this random thing. And then about six months after that, I was seeing my acupuncturist and he was working on me. And he said, you know, my mom was walking the Camino and she just broke her ankle. And I said, what? Okay, how am I the only person in the world who didn't know what the Camino was. Clearly everyone in the entire universe knows what this thing is.
I've been living in this, I don't know, hole or something that I didn't know. So another person. And then this. I'm not even kidding. A few months after that, another dear friend called who lived on the Oregon coast, and she said, look, I'm going to do something really strange.
But she was cleaning out her mother's study in Kansas. Her mother had kept everything for decades. Her mom was moved to an Alzheimer's care unit, and she said, I was going through the study, and I found this pamphlet for this kind of, like, walk.
And I just feel compelled to send it to you. I mean, she said, I don't even know why I'm doing this, but I'm going to put it in the mail today to send it to you. And I thought, okay, well, that's random and strange, like, whatever. And I get it a few days later, and I open the envelope, and it's a travel guide for the Camino from the 1960s. And so when I got this thing in the mail, I thought to myself, what is going on here? I don't even know what's happening. So I went over to my tarot cards, and I pulled a tarot card, and the tarot card said, you have not been listening to the messages we've been sending to you. And I thought, are you joking? I sat down on my bed, I cursed the universe, and I basically looked up at the sky and said, are you effing kidding me? You want me to walk the Camino? I don't do that. I don't hike. I don't walk. I'm not religious, by the way. I'm not catholic. I don't do things like this. You're crazy. This is absurd. But then over the following weeks, I started understanding that all these weird messages, these bizarre, bizarre messages, I mean, the chances of all these things happening for me were astronomical. And I thought, okay, I guess there's some reason I'm supposed to walk the camino. Even though I was still calling the universe stupid and being kind of whiny, I was really recalcitrant and very angry about the whole thing. But the second I decided and said, yes, I'm going to move forward and do this ridiculous thing, every single door blew open. I was able to quit my job and be fine. Someone moved into my house for the time that I was gone and took care of my animals. I mean, every door that I thought was barring me from doing it just blew open. So that's how I ended up walking the camino. And it ended up being this experience that was.
I don't know. I tell people it was a movie version of the Camino.
I had this distinct certainty that it was a journey that I'd always done, that it was always a part of my life, that I had done it 10,000 times before, and I was just showing up for an appointment and doing it another time. In that, like, if we do believe in the multiverse, I walk the Camino in every other multiverse, you know, place there is. It just felt like a distinct appointment. And, I mean, I really did have a movie version of the Camino. I France had the worst weather they'd had in 90 years. I decided to walk from southern France to northern France, and then along the spanish coast, everyone quit because it rained and snowed and hailed the entire time. I was covered in mud most of the time, but I've never been cared for and loved on and just taken care of by the French, by any population. I was in a foreign country where I really didn't speak the language. People went out of their way to take care of me, giving me free food, stopping me in the middle of the road and trying to understand what I was doing alone as a woman. Because I did this. I did a route that was known for the solitude, how lonely it was and how physically arduous it was, not knowing the weather would be terrible that year.
And so I got to spanish coast, and they said, do not walk in June or July in the spanish coast because it's hotter than Hades. And I thought, oh, it's the coast. It'll be cooler. And it was not cooler. I stopped going to the bathroom urinating because I got so dehydrated.
Finally, I'm crawling up the side of the spanish cliff with my pack on my back in the woods, and I just had that moment that you have in the movies where the person just gets broken open in the middle of the wilderness. And I broke, and I just howled out how old. And, you know, I tell people, the first thing I did was think, oh, gosh, I hope no one heard that. Oh, I hope no one heard that. Second, as a screenwriter, I thought, oh, my gosh, how boring. Kirsten, couldn't you have come up with something more exciting as far as what it looks like to break open? I was like, it's. You chose the most banal way to express this. And then the third, I had this. I had this sudden flash of insight. And I thought to myself, oh, my gosh, why did I think that? And that's when I understood that something in my life was very, very wrong, and I needed to heal it and or fix it.
And. But the second that happened, I knew. I hobbled into the next town, spent a few days in bed, then went to Santander, took a week in bed to rehydrate, and then took the ferry to Cornwall, and spent three weeks in Cornwall, which was the most amazing thing I've ever done. And then I took the Queen Mary back home.
It all together was a massive, massive adventure. And I have to tell everyone, take the Queen Mary if you can. They have breakfast in bed, everyone. And nobody can. You cannot underestimate the value of having breakfast in bed worth the price alone. Back then, I have to say.
[00:22:51] Speaker B: Okay, how did it change you?
[00:22:54] Speaker A: Well, for one, you know, I think at the outset, I understood just from all the messages I got to do the Camino, that there, it helped me to first see, I think, for the very first time that there are things going on in this reality, in this universe that we, as humans, don't have language for yet. And, you know, Carl Jung tried to talk about synchronicity and paying attention to the signs and what have you, and if I wouldn't have done that, I mean, I had the freedom to not walk the Camino. But it became so overt and ridiculous that I had no choice to. Well, in my mind, I had no choice. Many people might have said, whatever, I don't care. I'm not going to do this. I'm not leaving my job, not leaving my house to do this ridiculous thing that I don't even believe in. So it allowed me to get a peek behind the curtain of the universe and see what's possible. And then it also allowed me to understand that when I need to, I can show up for important things in my life that are supposed to happen, and that I don't run away screaming in terror and fear and that I have the guts, maybe you could say, or maybe the bravery, to face what life throws at me. So all of that was that. And then, of course, when I wrote you, I talked about compassionate possession, and that's a whole other thing that happened during the Camino that I can tell you about if you want.
[00:24:28] Speaker B: Please do.
[00:24:29] Speaker A: Yes. Okay.
Okay. So when I turned 40, I was not doing well. I was a complete wreck. I hadn't sleep for. Slept for weeks. I was just a nightmare. And I don't know what was going on. If it was turning 40 or what have you, but I was beside myself. I had a lot going on in my life. It was just a really terrible time in my life. And my dad and sister came and visited me in Oregon, and they went on a vacation. And one morning when I was really beside myself, we were at breakfast, and I could tell I was starting to have anxiety. So I went outside and I couldn't breathe. I couldn't manage my emotions. I was just really struggling.
And this is a little bit of a long story, but I'll be succinct. And I walked into the restaurant, and as I'm approaching their table, this is the first time this happened. I was standing there and I felt this.
I don't know what it was. Something came into me, into my brain. It felt like, and shoved my consciousness aside, because I remember part of my consciousness said, oh, my. What's going on? What's happening? I don't. And then these words came out of my mouth that were so mean and so hurtful and so out of character for myself, directed towards my sister. I mean, it was just really, really awful. And I'm. I'm not telling this story to give myself excuses, just that it completely destroyed everything that was going on at that moment. And the vacation was over for everyone, pretty much. I just destroyed everything. And there followed, I don't know, 23456 months of me feeling like I was insane. I called my mother crying. I cried for months. I was beside myself. I was distraught that I would say anything like that. I wondered if I should be put in a mental hospital because I did not understand what had happened. I was so devastated and bereft and broken by that experience. It really. It cut my legs out from underneath me. I just suffered so much. It was so terrible. And then a few years later, I was at my job at a restaurant, and it was about 630 in the morning. And there was a gentleman sitting at the end of the counter. He and I were the only ones there besides for the cook. And he was reading a book, and he was really gruff and grumpy and kind of a little, I don't know, snot. You can say he was a snot. And he's reading this book, and he wouldn't give me the time of day. And I thought, you know what? We're both here early in the morning. I'm going to make him talk to me. So I walk up to him and I say, oh, what are you reading? And he said, it's a book on math and logic. And again, this thing came into me, and my conscious part of my brain said, oh, my gosh, that thing is happening to me again. And then I started speaking and saying something, and then my brain said, oh, my gosh. How does this sentence end? I don't even know what I'm saying. I said, oh, so do you think math is invented or discovered? And so then we had this really crazy, and it just, whatever it was disappeared. And we had this incredible conversation that was so fabulous, and it was so great that when he left, I was super bummed and really sad about it because it was such a great conversation. And then he comes walking in the next day, and he said, I had to come back. And keep in mind that he was doing a tour for his college in Denver, and he was sent at the last minute because the guy who was supposed to go got sick at the last minute, so he wasn't even supposed to be there. But he said. Came back to the restaurant. He said, I have to tell you something really crazy. And I said, okay. And he said, one or two minutes before you came over and asked me about that book and asked me that question. I just finished three pages on whether math was invented or discovered. And he said, I can't even process what's happened, but I think you and I are supposed to know each other. And I was like, yay. I think we are, too. And so there began a really gorgeous and beautiful friendship, one of which I'm so grateful for. His friendship still today. And so, flash forward. So we're going through time. I decide to walk the Camino. I end up walking with this woman, and we walk multiple days. She's kind of a sour puss, really down on life, super judgmental, really unhappy, hates France, hates the people. She's one of those people that is just. Everything's negative. And it was pretty intense to walk with her, but she was also really good and didn't get lost. So I thought, I'm going to walk with her. And so we. We start walking one day. The weather is terrible. It is just a nightmare. And we finally get to this place where we're having dinner, me and she and another pilgrim, this. This guy. And she's complaining again about how terrible France is and how terrible the people are.
And I just said, you know, I gosh, I've not really had that experience, you know?
And she lost her beep. That's all I'm gonna say. I mean, she stood up from the table. The chair flew across the room. She was so angry. She started shouting at me. And crying, and basically gave me what's what about how I don't live in the real world, that I'm, you know, what am I trying to do to her? I mean, she basically lost it for, like, five minutes. The other pilgrim was like, I'm gonna. I'm going to, like, go to my bedroom and just stay there. And this other woman, she stormed outside, and it was really intense and really dramatic. And I thought to myself, okay, you can't run away, because I hate conflict. She's obviously really suffering. She's having something happened. I don't know quite what happened, but it was really terrible, and I don't want to run away from her. I have to stay here and listen to her. We have to have some sort of reconciliation or conversation.
And so she came back in, and she was still weeping, and she said, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I apologize. I don't know what came over me. But, you know, this, this and this are going on, and everyone knows you break down at least once on the Camino. That's just what happened. And I said. She sat down. I said, like, I said, look, I mean, I had been praying to think of something to say to her, praying, because I had no idea how to engage with this. And then finally I said, okay, so I have to tell you that what just happened was nothing.
I need to tell you that multiple years ago, I said something that was so horrific and so offensive and terrible to my sister, my dad, and my partner at the time, that it created a 50 miles wide circle of nuclear devastation. So this, what happened here, it was nothing. And she said, really? And I said, oh, oh, yeah. Yes.
Yeah. So don't even worry about it. This was not a big deal. And she still was sour pussy and, like, grumpy and. But she felt better. You know, it was like we had this conversation, and she was able to let go of some of her shame and her embarrassment and whatever, and we went to bed, and it was a normal good night. And so we walk a few more days, and I had. Ever since I've been walking for, like, a month at this .55 weeks. And when you're walking the camino, it's very important that you get a coquilla, a shell, the sign of the pilgrim, tied to your pack. And that year, there were no coquillas anywhere. So I felt like a faux pilgrim, but I had been walking anyway. And we get to the next town, and we split up. She goes to the hostel, and I stay somewhere else, but we meet for lunch the next day to say goodbye to each other, and she said, I have something for you. And I said, oh, my. Oh, wow, really? And she said, yes. She said, the gentleman where I'm staying, he has a ton of these. So she took a shell, she drilled a hole in it, put a string in it, and she said, I made this for you, and now you can hang it on your back.
And I was overjoyed, excited. Oh, my gosh. I finally ate a coquille. I was so excited. And I thought, oh, my gosh. Yay, I'm legit now. This is so exciting. And we had lunch, and we gave each other hugs, and we said goodbye. And it wasn't until a few days later that I realized, oh, my gosh.
The coquille, the shell was basically energy or spirit saying, okay, you showed up for a fellow pilgrim.
You gave her some grace or some forgiveness or whatever, and you completely changed her attitude about what had just happened. Here's your gift. Here's the shell.
This is your benediction for doing a good job. But then after that, I realized that I would not have been able to be present with her in that way or take away some of the shame and her embarrassment if I wouldn't have years before, totally and utterly humiliated myself by saying what I did to my sister, dad and partner at the time. And it was then that I understood that what had happened, even though I didn't understand it at the time, had a purpose years later.
And for me, that whole thing was just preordained. I mean, I was always going to go through that period of suffering where I said something that I would have never said and then.
But to be able to be present with her in that moment and share my story and help her, I said to myself, okay, I will suffer like that every time, because it just felt so good and positive to be able to be present with someone, listen to them, and help them out of feeling terrible or guilty or ashamed. So, yeah, so then I went to, you know, I'm in Santa Fe, New Mexico, and I went to a shaman to get some energy work, and I said to her, you know, this has happened to me a few times. I don't know what this is. And she said, oh, compassionate possession. Yeah, that happens to people all the time. And I said, what are you talking about? Okay, I'm sorry, what? And she said, oh, yeah, it's not. It's not that big of a deal. It really does. And I thought, oh, my God, if only I could have known this years ago, because I've been thinking that I'm slightly unhinged. So, yeah, that's my story.
[00:34:49] Speaker B: Well, no, that's a huge story. It's a wonderful story as well. I can relate to that momentary possession and how it changes people. I was working in a store, a retail store in the city in Sydney, and it was an area which was a little bit rough. And one guy came in and he was extremely threatening one time, and I thought, oh, no, something's going to happen here.
He started motioning like he was going to come around the counter and beat on me. And I'm thinking, what the hell is this? And then this strange thing actually came over me and my, I felt my face change and something pop in and straight out of my mouth said, that's not very nice, like a little boy. And he looked at me and he was like, he was shocked and he walked straight out like it just defused the situation instantly and, and turned it all around. And I, and I was standing there for minutes going, what? What was that? Where did that come from? It was so odd.
[00:35:47] Speaker A: That is. Yeah, that is odd and also astonishing. And, and it sounded like it might have saved your life or saved you from harm.
[00:35:55] Speaker B: Yeah, it did. Wow. Did. It definitely did. And like, it, it had no other feeling to it except for my face change and the words, and they weren't my words, and I don't know, I don't know what it was, but it was.
[00:36:05] Speaker A: So when that happened, were you, when that happened, were you thinking, what is going on?
[00:36:09] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. I was like, because it's happened so fast, I was like, whoa, what was all that about? You know, it's like, I don't know, but it changed everything instantly.
[00:36:19] Speaker A: That is unbelievable. I mean, again, that experience on the Camino, besides, for all the messages I got to walk the Camino, that experience on the Camino helped me to understand that again, there's way more going on in this universe then we, with our limited kind of senses, our ability to perceive, can understand at this point, which is why I love podcasts like yours. You know, you get to give us, you give us a little glimpse behind the curtain as well.
[00:36:47] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure. I had quite a few glimpses myself, so I like to actually share that with the world by talking to other people and hearing their experiences. So, yeah, thanks for seeing that.
I was going to ask you, so you've been through so many experiences like this and had profound changes. Does that actually made your experience of the world more magical?
[00:37:11] Speaker A: Well, I have to tell you that my relationship with, I don't know, energy or source is a little fraught because I'm grumpy, and I think that energy is like, that one over there is salty, so be careful. You know, whenever I'm given another message or to do something else, I always complain and call them a bunch of terrible names and say that they're stupid. So I think they've whatever that energy is or whatever has learned that you got to treat this one with kid gloves, because I'm always kind of annoyed by whatever is being requested. Now, that being said, I've also had a few instances, two or three at this point, where complete strangers have also come up to me and said, hey, I know we don't know each other, but I'm supposed to tell you this. You're supposed to know this.
And, you know, my friends laugh about me because. And they say, Kirsten, you never have to guess where you're supposed to go or what you're supposed to do. And they say, why does this always happen to you? And I. I tell them, well, it's because the universe knows I'm a beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep. And if I don't, you know, if. If they don't come out and just tell me overtly, I'm gonna be like, whatever, and walk away. So I have a kind of a fraught relationship with all of it, but for some reason, I think it amuses them. Now, that being said, you know, of course, since I've had all these experiences and these strange things happen, I absolutely believe that this world, I mean, that's what my podcast is about. I mean, I believe in miracles and magic, and I also believe, since I've read those science magazines for forever, that the only reason we call these things miracles or magic or what have you is because we haven't gotten to the place where we can understand them yet. They're probably very normal, but because humans as a whole are a suspicious group, and unless we have the scientific data to back something up, we're going to say, oh, that doesn't exist, or, oh, you must be insane, or, oh, you're making up a story. Because I think that mystery scares us inherently, something that we can't parse out or delineate or explain. I think it scares us. So I look forward to the day when you're like, hey, I just, like, something told me to give advice to this random stranger and was totally my compassionate possession by this guy named Mark. And, yeah. And everybody's like, oh, yeah, that's totally normal. Mine's named Andy, by the way. You know, I can't wait until that becomes the norm.
[00:40:04] Speaker B: Well, I think that, you know, the.
That way of seeing the world, you know, this is not a criticism in any way, but it might be just like a bit of a defense mechanism to make you feel a bit more boundary. You have boundaries and see. See the world in a certain sort of way. And, yeah, you know, I can understand that. I actually had a lot of that when I was growing up because I did actually, actually live in a sort of space which was very open, and then I had to shut that down to be able to communicate with people.
Yeah. Yeah. So I can understand that. And over time, that's been permeated by so many weird experiences and contact with the other. But I can understand why that happens.
Tell us about your podcast, bite sized blessings, and what is your aim with that? I mean, you did talk about a little bit there, but can you go into more detail?
[00:40:56] Speaker A: Yeah, it's bite sized blessings, and bite is spelled b y t e in homage to my scientific kind of mathematical worldview, because the podcast is a spiritual podcast. So, you know, someday I dream of uniting science and spirituality and some great global religion, but I'm not there yet. But my podcast is. I mean, it's meant to remind the world that there is magic up there, that there are inexplicable things happening of all sorts. And by the way, it's also a podcast about how humans create meaning. Okay? So, you know, some people, I ask everybody what is tell me a story of magic or something miraculous. And I've had everything from mothers to best friendships, to someone who died three times, to ghosts, to fairies. I mean, you name it. People have had so many different experiences, and I just want to remind people over and over that there's enough mystery in the world that we should all be excited to get up every day. And we don't know if something like that's going to happen to us. Maybe it will, maybe it won't. But the potential is high, and so that should give everyone hope and maybe a little more happiness, a little more joy, that this world is more mysterious than we could ever understand.
[00:42:20] Speaker B: For sure. For sure. Have you ever actually had any other experiences besides the compassionate possession that have touched you in a certain way and realized more magic is in the world than you can actually possibly comprehend?
[00:42:32] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. I had this dream that was so powerful that it kind of destroyed me for a few years.
I was floating out in the universe, and it was just pitch black with stars everywhere. And there was that really low space hum that's in the vacuum of space.
I was just floating out there and wondering and marveling at how beautiful it was. My heart was just so full. And then all of a sudden, this figure came on from the side and said, oh, you think that's real?
This is what's real.
And it reached down and picked up the curtain of the universe and pulled it back and showed me what was behind everything. And they would call it a classic noetic experience.
I can't even describe to you what was shown to me, except that it was beyond anything. I mean, beyond love, beyond wholeness, beyond divinity, beyond everything. And it was so shocking and so overwhelming that it woke me up out of my dream. And my entire room, bedroom was infused with that energy. And I remember, you know, it, my heart just being full of it, the room being full of it. And I thought, by the time I get home tonight, it's not going to be here anymore. And it wasn't. But there followed two years of being so bitter and so angry that I had this knowledge. I was so upset and resentful that I'd been shown that because life is hard. And it didn't mean that life got better. I still had struggles, depression, breakups, what have you. I was so angry that I started thinking every once in a while I would rather be there than here. Like this whole thing that's going on, that I'm in this real life. This is stupid. And anyone who would rather be here than where that place is is an idiot. And I don't want to be here anymore. I was really struggling with that because. And I was also angry at whoever it was had shown me this, because I was like, okay, I don't. I didn't want this knowledge. I didn't want to know this. This is ridiculous. You've just effed me up for the rest of my life. I'm totally screwed up now.
It was not a good time. And then I went to go see the same acupuncturist, and finally he said, you know, I wouldn't talk to him about it for months and months. And finally I confided and he said, okay, whoa. He said, all right, this is what we're going to work on now is getting you to want to stay here in this world because you have work to do. And you don't get shown something like this unless you have work to do. So now this is what we're going to concentrate on. And slowly, over the months, he helped me to find some peace with it. But, yeah, that changed my entire life. And it was not in a good way for a very, very long time. There was a lot of anger and rage and suffering and resentment. At first it was amazing. You know, that day in the bedroom and that vision, it was just absolutely exquisite. But then once I understood kind of what I'd been shown, I was just. I was so angry.
[00:45:46] Speaker B: Creates a longing, doesn't it?
[00:45:48] Speaker A: Yes. Yes.
So now you know why. Yeah, yeah. Now, you know, I. This is just another example of how those entities or those energies are like, that one over there is a little salty. Be careful.
[00:46:02] Speaker B: We showed it too much too early.
[00:46:04] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:46:08] Speaker B: Okay, Kirsten, so we're getting towards the end of the podcast. How can people find points of contact for you?
[00:46:16] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. So everything's on my website, website bitesized, blessings.com, and it is. It's b y t e. You can find links to my books, my Peter Rabbit series. You can find a link to my murder of two animated series, more about me, more about my podcast, my guests, all of that. It's all there, including an email address if you want to reach out to me.
[00:46:38] Speaker B: Excellent. Excellent. Thank you so much for coming onto super normalized and sharing your experience of the world and how it's touched you and how it's changed you. It's been a great show and I'm sure the listeners would appreciate it. So thank you very much, Kirsten, thanks.
[00:46:51] Speaker A: For having me on. It's been super fun.
[00:46:53] Speaker B: Awesome, awesome. I'll just say goodbye to the listeners again. That was a great episode with Kirsten, and if you enjoyed this show and valued it in some way, please, if you're on YouTube, like and subscribe, or if you're not on YouTube and you're on a podcast app and you think, well, somebody else needs to hear this, just pop it open. Oh, I bumped my microphone. Pop it open and hit that share button and send it just to one person. That'll help me a lot. And, yeah, thank you so much for listening. And if you enjoyed today's show, please reach out to Kirsten and tell her as well. I'm sure she'd really appreciate it. And yeah, until next episode, it's bye for now.
